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Gilbert tour: A school on the cutting edge

A school that is STEM-certified can draw students from far and wide. That is what happened to Gilbert Elementary School after the school suffered a loss of students when the Bluebird plant closed in their LaFayette community, according to Damon Raines, Walker County's school superintendent.

In fact, Gilbert is one of only 13 STEM-certified schools in Georgia.

But, Gilbert Elementary has other claims to fame. For example, this Title 1 School not only also offers Forest Kindergarten, Raines says Gilbert was "the first publicly-funded forest kindergarten in the United States."

Gilbert now has two forest kindergartens; and, two forest first grades, according to Raines, who also says Saddle Ridge has a forest kindergarten now, too.

According to Raines, this is a unique program that allows these students to spend half of their day outside, every day, and it doesn't matter the

weather, unless it is very bad — and then they bring them indoors.

The Gilbert Elementary School sits in the midst of 117 acres that the Gilbert Family (the Bank of LaFayette) own that property, and they have given all of that for us to use. It's their property, but they allow us to do what we want to do on it for the school, according to Raines.

According to Beth Pelham, the principal for Gilbert Elementary School, there are "about 35 certificated teachers" teaching at the school in the classrooms. However, Pelham says "we have a lot of support personnel as well, like in special education, paraprofessionals, etc."

Special needs kids

And when it comes to special education students, Pelham estimates that this particular student population is about 20% of the student body. Raines said that the state average for special needs students is "about 11%. We run 17 in our district."

Raines said Gilbert is at 20%, Rock Spring is at 23%, and Rossville Elementary is at 22% and that "we feel that our numbers are higher because people bring their kids to us, because they know they are going to have their needs met."

"My heart is special ed. And it is always going to be that," Raines said, which is why he mentioned Project Search, because "I'm heavily involved in Project Search, which is something for our kids who are aging out. But, it gets them a job and that's close to my heart."

According to the superintendent, "the school system is allowed to keep special needs students until their 22nd birthday, but our goal is to get them a job somewhere (when they graduate). We want to get them employed."

Title 1 school stats

Overall total enrollment of students ranges from 500 to 508 or 512, Pelham said, but they average around 500 students total in a given day.

Unlike the 98% free-and-reduced Rossville Elementary School, which is the highest free-and-reduced percentage school in the Walker County school system; Gilbert Elementary is 87% free-and-reduced, according to Pelham, so it takes the second spot overall in the Walker school system.

But, with its amazing achievements in the STEM arena, and its cutting-edge forestry programs, one would assume this school has tons of money at its disposal. It does not.

Principal expounds on programs

According to the former academic coach-turned-principal, "We are an amazing school. We have a lot of outdoor education going on here with STEM. We have two kindergarten forest classrooms and two first grade forest classrooms. We have a hydroponics lab, we have lego robotics, we have a lot of art activities. We do archery... VEX Robotics."

"Our fifth graders go to a camp every year for a week. They do fishing, canoeing, and they spend a lot of time at the campfire. But that is a great experience for them, because it is a week long. The whole grade level goes; the teachers go. Mr. Green or I, one, will accompany them, too," Pelham said.

So, who pays for this camp adventure for the students?

"What they do is they sell candy bars (to raise the money)," Pelham said. And, she ordered those candy bars this month, so it is hoped that the community will purchase as many as they can to help these fifth graders get to go on this outdoor adventure with their fellow students this year.

Pre-K to fifth grade, Gilbert Elementary is anything but a typical elementary school. Of course there are the typical traditional elementary school staples: the media center, the gym, the art class...

And then there are the exceptional aspects: that children as young as pre-k are working on STEM projects involving things as cutting-edge as robotics. They call it the VEX class. Gilbert has created classrooms with no walls — classrooms outdoors, that is.

VEX competitions is another unique aspect of Gilbert, as the school can boast a robotics program so competitive that Gilbert is a state champion in robotics and nationally they came in third place, according to Raines. They have even competed in the world VEX competition.

But, lest the public thinks that art — the old school process of developing creativity with crayons and other mediums — is missing from this cutting-edge school, like it has been from Rossville Elementary (at least before this year); think again. Gilbert has art, too.

And Gilbert has a phenomenal art teacher in Ms. Brown, according to Pelham, who says Brown does "an amazing job," especially by collecting all the children's best art for submission to the Artrageous Antics art show.

Paint is not the only thing Gilbert children get on their hands. They also play in the dirt and grow things using a hydroponics lab. They grow all types of lettuce and things, which get donated to a food bank, so this school is giving back as much as it is training up children in a myriad of ways.

But, what about all those children learning and playing outside in the elements. What if there were an accident?

No worries. The school is prepared, according to Raines, since there is a nurse on the premises and a primary health care center on the school property as well, serving students, parents, and even the school faculty's medical needs.

Gilbert Elementary is a one-stop school, offering a little bit of everything and excelling at it all. And, it seems to have a very energetic and committed staff eager to get the new year rolling.

BoE passes millage rate, increases teacher pay

Walker County School Board of Education member Bobby McNabb was the lone standout on the five-member entity tasked with determining if raising property taxes was the right way to fund the 2019-2020 new operational budget for the local school system.

McNabb declined to provide an explanation for his decision when contacted, simply choosing to make his position known with a "no" hand raise during the voting on Thursday, July 25th.

The other four board members — Karen Stoker, Phyllis Hunter, Dale Wilson, and Mike Carruth — raised their hands in a show of support for the measure to be approved, which will raise local property taxes in order to fund the school system's new budget for 2019-2020.

The tentative budget for fiscal year 2019-2020 was $85,452,679 for salaries and benefits in the budget and $9,149,488 for operational expenses.

More teacher pay raises coming

Damon Raines, the school system's superintendent, shared some new information at this most recent meeting, telling the audience that:

"I don't want to get pitted against the governor, because we appreciate what he is trying to do (by giving teacher's raises), but maybe in that whole thought process they didn't think through it as far as they could."

According to Raines, "They want to continue local control, but they also want to please the voting base. The teachers are a large voting base. But, we did approach him and let him know what kind of pressure that is going to put on the local budget."

"The fear is that, initially, he guaranteed $5,000, but we are already contemplating when does the other two ($2,000) show up. Because that is going to continue a little bit of pressure on us locally to be able to fund that," Raines said.

The school superintendent lamented that the governor did not choose to design the raise via a percentage method, which he says would have "been easier for us to do. But, we are working within the confines of what we were given and very appreciative of getting that as well."

"But, then again, there could be more (coming), so we are going to have to figure out what that need is going to look like as well," Raines said, referring to the other $2,000 the governor guaranteed out of the billions found in the coffers at the state level, which he chose to share with the teaching segment of the state at this time.

Tax commissioner: "Don't cheat yourself"

Tax Commissioner Carolyn Walker said that her office encourages anyone aged 70 and older to come into her office in order to be assisted with an assessment that will determine if (and how much) their taxes could be reduced due to exemptions that are available.

Walker is concerned that elderly individuals do not understand this exemption process.

"We don't want them to cheat themselves (out of the exemption)," she said. Some elderly people might not have to pay anything in taxes regarding the new mill age rate increase, while others might have some to pay.

"We ask them to bring in their most recent tax return when they come," Walker said, since a lot of people get confused about whether they are eligible or not. We want to make sure everyone who is eligible receives the correct exemption amount.

"Some do not understand that the exemption is not based upon what they receive from social security. Instead, it is based on net earned income," she said.

Mayor clarifies Rossville crime news

Teddy Harris

Rossville is getting a lot of attention lately, but Mayor Teddy Harris feels some of it isn't deserved.

"One of the things that is totally out of the city's control is how crime is reported by the media," Harris said. "Ninety-five percent of articles that are about crime in Rossville is not in the city limits. The zip code for Rossville is huge — and I mean huge. It covers parts of Catoosa and Walker counties."

The mayor is correct.

The city's 30741 zip code spans an area that stretches as far north as the Tennessee state line and as far southwest as Wallaceville, Ga., which is nestled between Chattanooga Valley and Chickamauga. In addition, the zip code also covers as far southwest as Cloud Springs Road.

Yet the city is officially a mere 1.8 square miles in size.

How crime is reported

When crime is reported for uniform crime reporting purposes by law enforcement to the Federal Bureau of Investigations, it is reported based on the jurisdictional geographical area where the crime occurred.

So if the address has a Rossville zip code, regardless if it is in the city proper or on the outskirts, it is labeled "Rossville."

News organizations follow suit and any zip code or city listed for a suspect's address in an arrest report — or the zip code or city reported as the crime location in such reports — is reflected accordingly in their accounts.

Rossville crime handled by city

"If a crime or incident happens in the city of Rossville," Harris said, "it will be the Rossville Police Department that responds to the situation, not one of the other agencies (like Walker County Sheriff's Office or Catoosa County Sheriff's Office)."

Sid Adams, director of public safety for Rossville (aka as the Rossville Police Department), discussed the low crime rate in the city in a Walker County Messenger article in mid-July.

According to Adams, only 21 arrests occurred between June 24 and July 9 in Rossville. Adams said the city has not had a murder in a few years and that domestic violence assaults are one of the more common problems within city jurisdiction.

This focus on whether crime is occurring in the small city of Rossville or in the surrounding suburbs might seem like the splitting of hairs, since the area where the crime occurs is happening within a recognized geographical area labeled Rossville by the US Postal Service.

However, Mayor Harris feels he has a responsibility to foster a correct image of the city that he promotes and governs, so he is seeking to do that through media.

Perception challenged

"There is a diversity in our city because of the mom-and-pop businesses, and that is a great thing," Harris said. "The city will have somewhere between 190 to 220 businesses at any one time. The vast majority are small businesses. Down Lake Avenue is Hudlow Axle, the anchor for what I call a motorsport cluster. Several businesses catering to motor sports are here."

"The crime articles gives the city a perception to the rest of the Chattanooga metro area that Rossville is an area of high crime," Harris said. "I struggle with this false perception of high crime because this is not the case. I struggle with the false perception that every thing south of I-24 to the state line is in Rossville. In reality it is East Lake.

"This is what we struggle with when it comes to perception. I believe with the new Federal Opportunity Zone designation that our city will be attracting investors and developers," Harris said.

"So in the meantime our city needs to continue to educate the metro area on what is the city of Rossville and what is surrounding communities," Harris said.

"Ninety-five percent of articles that are about crime in Rossville is not in the city limits. The zip code for Rossville is huge — and I mean huge. It covers parts of Catoosa and Walker counties.

Mayor Teddy Harris

Q&A with Corey Griffin

Griffin speaks about K9's death after on-duty incident

Second of two articles

Deputy Griffin, since the first part of this article ran last week we have had a chance to talk again. You mentioned that you had been back to see your doctor. What did he say about your condition, especially regarding your injured arm?

He said my arm was looking better and that there is muscle damage. He also said that I have to go to physical therapy and then go back to him for a followup doctor visit in three weeks. I will be out of work until then.

Last week in our interview you were sharing that Rocky was a dog that had not really ever been in the military or law enforcement and was basically just 22 months old with no real training when you received him?


You also said in the conclusion of that article that dogs without a "drive" ended up being used just as a bomb or narcotics dogs because they still can do the "smell" that is needed; they just don't have that other ability. But Rocky had "drive," so he was able to be used for apprehension and tracking, too?


The "smell" ability can be used for tracking such as finding lost children?

You know, people that might run, children that are lost, or Alzheimer's patients, or whatever, because of their nose. But the ones that have the super-high drive — prey drive — then they use those for dual purposes. And, dual-purpose are trained in narcotics or bomb, whichever your department or the military uses.

So, one of the two of those — narcotics or bombs — and then they do tracking; they do apprehension; they do article searches. Which, basically, if I took something and threw it out into the middle of the field, I could send him out (Rocky) and he would go find it. It could be a credit card; it could be keys, whatever.

The best scenario I use when I teach our K9 class is (for the law enforcement side) that when you're chasing somebody, whether it be in a car or on foot, and they throw something...

Like trying to get rid of their drugs?

Yes, or it's a gun, or a knife, and they might have been involved in a domestic or a murder, so as you chase them you see that item being thrown out, so you take note of it or tell someone they threw something out over here or over there. So, I tell the class that we can take the dogs back after that once the take down or apprehension is over with and then find that item — whatever it is.

So, Rocky was successful in doing that?

Yes. I actually used him once or twice on that where they had thrown some stuff out. One time it was drugs. Actually, both times I think it was drugs. So, we went to where they actually thought the drugs were and Rocky actually found the drugs.

What happens to these dogs when they get a whiff of those toxic drugs like meth and heroin, which are sometimes "cut" (the term used for when other more potent products are added to a drug to intensify its effect)?

Like fentanyl?

Yes. What happens when that dog gets a whiff of that? Did Rocky ever have any of that type of encounter?

Luckily, no. We've kind of been fortunate that we haven't — I mean, we've had encounters with the fentanyl — and, it's as deadly to a dog as it is a human (because only three granules is all it takes to kill you).

If you touch it, it absorbs into your skin and you can go OD (overdose). Same thing for the dogs. We actually have the Narcan spray, so if we go to a scene and someone has overdosed, we can administer that.

And, as the K9 handler, we had an extra Narcan for the dog. But then we found out that the nasal version (of Narcan) would actually kill a dog, because of the reaction that animals have to it, so we had to go back and get injectables of Narcan. So we had those with us "just in case" we ever run across it.

But, Rocky never had to have it. And, luckily, Missy never has had to have it.

How many drug busts would you say you did with Rocky?

A bunch. I would have to go back and pull reports and forms to give an exact number, but over the four years we used him on the side of the road, running cars that we had stopped.

He's been used several times inside houses with the drug task force (Lookout Mountain Judicial Drug Task Force) and ourselves (the Walker County Sheriff's Office), just to search for narcotics in houses.

So, he's probably conducted thousands of searches in four years?

Oh yeah, we've been to both high schools in the county. We go there at least once a year, if not more. So, searching cars, classrooms, lockers; he's done that the last four years. Four

times at each high school, at minimum, and not counting all the cars that we've stopped and all the houses he has searched the past four years.

We've took him in the jail here and ran them through the jail. They (the K9s) have been used out of the county, too, in other schools. We went to Rome High School back...

So his loss is going to be felt. And he is going to need to be replaced whether you are the future dog's handler or not.


Did Rocky ever have a handler besides you?


Back to the training Rocky had, so other than the basic training done by the handlers before you got him, what type of training did you and he have?

I spent six weeks in Anniston, Alabama. That's where AMK9 is, so they have instructors and they have dog trainers there. They basically teach you. We had a classroom portion of going through...

So that's like an intensive training sort-of-thing, sun up to sun down?

Yeah, we would do daytime stuff and then there was a whole week, I think week four and five we did it at nighttime, because it completely changes everything. The lighting and even the weather is different and other things at night. We would come in like at 3 o'clock in the afternoon and work until 1, 2, or 3 in the morning, just to change it up.

Like I said, the classroom basically has a first aid/medical side to it. We actually did IVs on a dog in case we ever needed to have to do it, because they teach you about the heat exhaustion and signs of heat stroke for your dog. And then, for overdoses due to narcotics and basic wound care for the K9, stuff like that. Of course, if it was anything else, straight to the vet ye shall go.

So it was everyday that we were training, doing something all day long. I know we did tracks. I, personally, probably did four tracks a day while in school on top of doing narcotics (training), doing apprehension work, doing....

You just wanted to make sure he was ready, I guess?

Yeah, everybody done it. We started out short at first because they were green dogs and everybody was still learning. But, at the end of the six weeks, to have your certification — which is through NAPWDA (North American Police Work Dog Association), which is probably one of the biggest dog certifications in the U.S. — you have to successfully track with your K9 on a quarter-mile long track.

The track used for the certification test had to have a minimum of two turns in it, at least one surface change...

Meaning from ground to asphalt or concrete surface change? To show the dog can track without losing the smell?

Ground to gravel, ground to asphalt...something. It had to change. And then it had to have at least one cross-track, which means that the track you are supposed to be on, at some point during that track (and you would not know where it was), someone would come walking across it somewhere. And we were to not take the dog to do the track until about an hour or an hour and a half later.

And that teaches the dog that just because you come up on a new scent that that's not to distract them; they are supposed to stay on the scent that they are on.

So, how did Rocky do on that? Did he stay on task?

Oh yeah. When we were in school, and really up to, to now really, he was the top or the second top dog in tracking. He just picked up on it real good. A lot of it is in the handling of the leash...

And the relationship with the handler?

You don't want to keep the leash super tight, but you want to keep the tension on it, because especially at night. You have to learn at nighttime you aren't going to be able to use your flashlight. Because, one, it is going to mess your night vision up. And, two, it messes the dog's vision up. So, you have to work off-leash tension.

So, if the leash has slack in it, you know to stop or slow up. Or, if it was really getting tight, then you need to pick your pace up. But, Rocky was good.

So that's the signal between the dog and the handler: the leash?

Yeah, especially at nighttime. Of course in the daytime you can see them, so you're watching their body movements. That's actually one of the things we had to learn. It's called COB, or change of behavior. You had to learn what your dog's change of behavior is, because some dogs change might be that their ears stand up.

I've seen one dog's change of behavior was one ear stands up and the other is down. So, whatever task you might be at, like, if it was narcotics, then whenever the dog got into that odor he is supposed to smell then there would be a change of behavior.

And then there is "in odor" and then there is "at the source," behaviors. Pointing to an object nearby, Deputy Griffin demonstrated: "Say if this was full of drugs, then when he (Rocky or other K9 dogs) walked in the door over there (across the room), he would probably smell it and his body behavior would change.

And, as he got over here (near to the item he is trained to be seeking), it would change again. And then he would, ideally, do the final response, which is to sit.

A lot of people think 'well, their supposed to bark, or their supposed to scratch. No. They are called passive alert dogs, which means they sit wherever the source is and they stay there. It don't matter what you do, if you have a good trained narcotics dog and he is on source, he's not going to come off that for nothing. I don't care what you do to him, he's not supposed to come off.

Because they know based on the way they've been trained that "If I smell that, and I sit, then I get my ball, and I get to play." And that's all they work for, to get that ball.

So, that's their pay-off?

Rocky was actually funny. I was telling the sheriff that Rocky's change of behavior — ya know, he had ears like antennas; they were huge, and, of course, he was bobtailed, so he had that little nub — his ears would get as tall as they could get, and his nub would start doing a hundred miles an hour, and then he would sit and do this:

(Deputy Griffin shows what happens at a tennis match at Wimbledon, when the spectators heads moves back and forth from one side to the other, left and then right). Rocky's behavior mimicked it, obviously, looking towards his handler in one directionand the prize he sought to have thrown in the other direction.

He would look at me as if to say "I found it, now where's my ball. Give me my ball."

Oh, like I'm ready for the payoff?

Yeah. And, he would constantly look at me. He would be waiting on the ball to come. He would stay put, but he would even scoot on his butt to turn to look at me, to see if I was getting it...that he wanted his Kong.

Silence...Deputy Griffin gets lost in reflection, so we give him a minute. His heart seems broken over his loss, but he composes himself.

Well, I had wondered what was the payoff for the dog after they found the drugs or made the apprehension.

In apprehension, the bite — as bad as it sounds — the bite is their payoff. So, on apprehension work they didn't get their ball because the bite is their reward. But, in narcotics and article searches (anything other than tracking or apprehension) the ball was their reward.

I've got to see this "ball". Is it like a normal ball?

It's a Kong. But, it really depends, because every dog is different. Some dogs don't even like Kongs. Some dogs like tennis balls. Some use little tugs, or pieces of rope. And, you figure that out in school when you are going through training with them.

Rocky always just liked a Kong. They are made to put treats down them, and everybody (in the public) was always saying that "ya'll load them down with narcotics (the Kong) and give it to them (the dogs)," but no, I could show them my Kong for Rocky and they could test it and there was never anything put in it. It's never had no food; it's never had no drugs. All it's ever had is his slobber in it.

And, like I said, some dogs — I know Missy prefers a tennis ball. It is based on what dogs want.

His Kong (Rocky's) was beside him on Wednesday (during the memorial service). His black Kong, with a rope in it. And the rope is just so we can grab it and play tug with them. But, he wasn't big on that — and that was what I was telling the sheriff, too.

Missy, all the dogs that we've had in the past, especially if you were playing with them, throwing a ball with them, that's a big bonding thing that they tell every handler to do: to play with them, throw a ball with them, play tug with them. But Rocky, he never was...I'd throw it and he'd rather lay down and chew on it. And, I would be like: Dude, bring it back and I will throw it again.

And, I would have to tell him the command to come back to my side, but you could see he was like" "I don't really want to take it back over there, because I just want to go chew on it..."

But, he would. We would play. And he would chase it three or four times, but when he got tired of it, wherever it landed, that's where he would lay down and just chew on it a little bit. So, he really wasn't crazy about playing the fetch part with it. Whereas Missy, I know that's all she wants to do. She trembles. She would probably do that until she had a heart attack.

Is she younger?

Their six months apart. She's six months younger than Rocky.

A different type of dog, too.

But, even Thea, who was also a Belgian Malinois. She was like that. She loved it.... just throw it, throw it, throw it. Their whole body would just shake with excitement as if to say: "Just throw it; throw it; throw it!"

And both of them would just play that until they would almost be falling over with exhaustion. But, you would throw it again and they would go get it. But, he wasn't like that. I kind of wished he was, but....

Well, and Rocky's thing — the sheriff said it Wednesday — he wanted you to chase him with it. And we would do that constantly. He would crouch down on his fronts, and his butt would be up in the air, and his nub going ninety miles an hour. And Dalton (Deputy Griffin's son) would chase him around the house. I've got a lot of videos of them doing that.

I don't know if you saw that picture Wednesday, of Rocky lying down and Dalton had his hands on his knees. Dalton and Rocky had been chasing each other around the house for 45 minutes and they finally got tired and fell down together.

But that was his (Rocky's) thing. It wasn't fetch. It was come chase me. But you wasn't going to catch him, because he was too quick.

Thinking about Dalton, your son, that's a big emotional loss for a kid to get attached to an animal, a pet, and then to know it's their father's partner. How is he doing?

He's okay. I know Wednesday (July 17) when we got home (from the memorial service for Rocky) we both took a long nap. One, because I didn't sleep the night before — at all. So, I was just exhausted. He was okay. He went back to his mother's that night. So when I talked to him yesterday, he seemed like he was okay, but...I know that every time he comes to my house, I know that for a while it will be kind of a repeat...

I guess that is an influencing factor for you, too, of whether to go back into the K9 handling position, just because of this kind of emotional thing to go through if you go into it again and...

Something else happens.

Like a bad guy shoots your dog, or whatever...


That would be another emotional loss for him.

Yeah. I know. Right. And, I know I have said it, told people before that whenever I have talked about putting in for a promotion or another job — because back in March I put in for the drug task force when they needed an agent, and he was like "But, what about Rocky?"

And, I said, oh, Rocky will have to go to another handler. And he said, "You can't go then." And I said, "Why not?" And he said, "Because that's going to be my dog when you retire," because you know when we retire these dogs, as the handler, we have the option whether to keep them for ourselves.

And, so Dalton was like "because Rocky is going to be my dog when I get older and I move out, he will come live with me." And, I was like "Rocky's got a long time to be working. He's just six. He'll probably work until he's 10 or 11 years old, if his health stays up."

It does sound like you are ready for a change now. You definitely need one now, since you have been serving as a traffic patrol unit member for eight years, did you say?


Well, I hope you get the detective position that is open, because you've done a phenomenal job.

Thank you.

And what about SWAT? I will stay on SWAT regardless, since it is a voluntary basis, and I volunteered. I've been on it for eight or nine years.

Is there anything in particular that you want the public to know, specifically about this situation — your loss and how you feel?

No, I mean there are, but I'll just keep those comments to myself, just because of the things I've read since this and I had to quit reading them. I was told when it come out (the news about the shooting, not this article), my phone started blowing up: "Don't read them; don't read them. (the comments uninformed people were making on social media). And, I was like, well, too late. It's just that people don't understand.

No, they don't. And, then there's people who are malicious and just trying to be mean and negative.

And, you know, my thing is — and, I finally, after I quit getting mad over it — thought that half these people, if not all, have never handled a K9 dog; they've never put my boots on and walked (in my shoes, on my job). Rocky was never mistreated.

But K9 dogs have to be corrected if they are not behaving as they are supposed to in life-or-death situations like you and other officers face on these apprehensions and dangerous traffic stops, and drug raids or when you serve felony warrants.

Right. We went through a ton of obedience training in the training school. And, we have to go through re-certifications every year. And, it is a week long. And, if any problems have occurred, from that previous year, then when you go to re-cert you say, "Okay, I'm having this problem." And, it can be something very minor, like the handler is doing it, like with the leash control...to something major, like the dog has just quit doing it, like he don't want to do this anymore.

But they work it, and they fix it, and they tell you things to work on. That's what I did back in November, when I got bit by him. It was the same kind of situation.

Was that also kind of like the same situation, as in a highly chaotic environment like this July 6 incident?

It was. It was. I mean there was probably 30 of us at one time. Those dogs of course have their own adrenaline. They're feeding off everyone else's adrenaline, and he was feeding off my adrenaline, so....

If you know how you feel with your own adrenaline, so if you add 40 more people's on you, that's a lot.

So, tell me if what I've heard is correct.

I have heard that with the K9 dogs and the handlers, because of that very potential — that it is so highly likely to happen, that the tension and adrenaline experienced in these stressful takedowns and house raids, etc. — that it is recommended that K9s are kept in the patrol car until they absolutely have to be brought to the highly-charged scene to avoid one attacking a cop, like happened to you?

Not really, because if you wait until you need them, it might actually be too late. A lot of the times they are there, right in the midst of it. Like I have said, some are not as driven as others. But, they are still patrol dogs and they still have that drive, but some it's just all they live for. And, Rocky liked that part of his job.

I had six street bites with him, where people had run